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Kimster
(@kimster)
Joined: 8 months ago
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05/08/2020 5:27 pm  

Hi friends, just would like to add some information that I noticed recently:

 

https://integrativeoncology-essentials.com/2019/04/anticancer-effects-of-inositol-and-ip-6/

Anticancer Effects of Inositol and IP-6

Apr 27, 2019

 

https://www.canceractive.com/article/is-ip6 a cure for cancer

Is IP6 a Cure for Cancer?

 

 

https://youtu.be/o-CeYlfVURs?list=PLV8r7WNM4ZipWNQwcKFQf70sdFuZDnOuj

The Amazing Benefits of Phytic Acid?

15 Jul 2018

 

Thanks.

Kimster

 


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J
 J
(@na)
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05/08/2020 7:19 pm  

@kimster

Thanks!

Here's a FAQ from the Dr. Shamsuddin:

http://www.ip-6.net/faq.html


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GgE
 GgE
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05/08/2020 10:00 pm  
Posted by: @johan

Here's a FAQ from the Dr. Shamsuddin:

http://www.ip-6.net/faq.html

The FAQ reads:

What is the source of IP6 and Inositol?

The two main sources of reagent-grade IP6 and Inositol are rice (rice bran) and corn. Most of the nutraceutical-grade compounds are extracted from rice bran. The purity of Inositol is >99.8%; however due to the complex and tedious nature of extraction and purification, hence cost, while the reagent-grade IP6 is about 98% pure, that of nutraceutical grade range from 50-92%. Of course the purer the compound, the more efficient, and even more importantly safe it is; over a certain level of purity the cost becomes exorbitant”

There’s a huge difference between 50% and 98%. Would it be safe using reagent grade 98% pure rather than a 50% nutraceutical where we don’t know what the other 50% is?

Does anyone know if the purification process introduces any hazardous ingredients?


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GgE
 GgE
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06/08/2020 1:35 am  
Posted by: kimster

This link doesn’t seem to work, at least not for me. Can you please check it out?

From https://integrativeoncology-essentials.com/2019/04/anticancer-effects-of-inositol-and-ip-6/

This site seems to clarify the dose needed:

“The authors stated that this dose was likely too low to see any anticancer activity as the effective dose levels used in animal studies extrapolated to humans would be higher. They wrote: “Extrapolated from animal data, in the absence of a dose-determination study in humans, the recommended prophylactic dosage of IP6 + Inositol is 1-2 g/day and a cancer therapeutic dosages 8-12 g/day[ref].” And

“Recent phase I study of inositol for lung cancer chemoprevention showed that in a daily dose of 18 g for 3 months, inositol was safe and well tolerated [ref].”

Great info, Kim. Thanks 


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J
 J
(@na)
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06/08/2020 2:36 am  

@gge

Inositol is obtained by hydrogenation of hexahydroxy benzene, and hexahydroxy benzene can be obtained from the reaction of carbon monoxide with potassium. 


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GgE
 GgE
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06/08/2020 2:56 am  
Posted by: @johan

@gge

Inositol is obtained by hydrogenation of hexahydroxy benzene, and hexahydroxy benzene can be obtained from the reaction of carbon monoxide with potassium. 

Thanks. This may be a couple of the steps but there must be other steps because this doesn’t explain where the phosphorus comes from.

I wonder if there’s any benzene residue left in the reagent grade. Any thoughts


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J
 J
(@na)
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06/08/2020 3:20 am  

IP6 is a phosphorylated form of inositol. Magnesium and calcium is added.

The easiest way to phosphorylate inositol is to heat it with H3PO4 under reduced pressure at 150°C for 6 h. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/0038071784901299


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J
 J
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06/08/2020 3:23 am  
Posted by: @gge

I wonder if there’s any benzene residue left in the reagent grade. Any thoughts

I don't know.


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J
 J
(@na)
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06/08/2020 3:36 am  

Regarding IP6 and inositol from food, it's important to know this:

"IP6 obtained from food is bound to protein. Before it can be absorbed by the body, it must be freed from this protein by the enzyme phytase that is present in food and naturally in the intestinal tract. The power of the phytase enzyme is damaging to IP6 and renders much of it inactive and therefore less effective when obtained in this form. Pure IP6 from a supplement is not bound to protein and is easily absorbed intact and able to provide its complete medicinal properties."

https://www.vitamor.com/page.htm?/ingredienten/fytinezuur.htm&Introductie


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GgE
 GgE
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06/08/2020 4:15 am  
Posted by: @johan

"IP6 obtained from food...must be freed...by the enzyme phytase that is present...naturally in the intestinal tract. The power of the phytase enzyme is damaging to IP6 and renders much of it inactive.

Pure IP6 from a supplement is easily absorbed intact and able to provide its complete medicinal properties."

I imagine that the gut phytase enzyme also damages some of the IP6 from supplements. This might be one reason why the dose needed is so high.


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J
 J
(@na)
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06/08/2020 4:24 am  

@gge

great observation, yes


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J
 J
(@na)
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06/08/2020 4:34 am  

here´s a good review on IP6

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/1750-3841.13320


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Kimster
(@kimster)
Joined: 8 months ago
Posts: 51
06/08/2020 5:01 am  
Posted by: @gge
Posted by: @johan

"IP6 obtained from food...must be freed...by the enzyme phytase that is present...naturally in the intestinal tract. The power of the phytase enzyme is damaging to IP6 and renders much of it inactive.

Pure IP6 from a supplement is easily absorbed intact and able to provide its complete medicinal properties."

I imagine that the gut phytase enzyme also damages some of the IP6 from supplements. This might be one reason why the dose needed is so high.

Hi, not sure whether the following information would be relevant:

 

https://www.abvista.com/Products/Quantum-Blue/Benefits-of-superdosing.aspx

 

Thanks.

Kimster


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J
 J
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GgE
 GgE
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06/08/2020 6:49 am  
Posted by: @gge

I imagine that the gut phytase enzyme also damages some of the IP6 from supplements.

Apparently zinc compounds neutralizes gut phytase.
This is a study on dog food preparation. They consider phytase a problem for dogs’ absorption of food nutrients. Lots of interesting info in here.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7142709/

Would taking zinc supplements reduce the amount of IP6 needed? Zinc is usually considered a good addition to anti-cancer treatments.

May be zinc gluconate to make it even better?


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Kimster
(@kimster)
Joined: 8 months ago
Posts: 51
06/08/2020 10:57 am  
Posted by: @gge
Posted by: kimster

This link doesn’t seem to work, at least not for me. Can you please check it out?

From https://integrativeoncology-essentials.com/2019/04/anticancer-effects-of-inositol-and-ip-6/

This site seems to clarify the dose needed:

“The authors stated that this dose was likely too low to see any anticancer activity as the effective dose levels used in animal studies extrapolated to humans would be higher. They wrote: “Extrapolated from animal data, in the absence of a dose-determination study in humans, the recommended prophylactic dosage of IP6 + Inositol is 1-2 g/day and a cancer therapeutic dosages 8-12 g/day[ref].” And

“Recent phase I study of inositol for lung cancer chemoprevention showed that in a daily dose of 18 g for 3 months, inositol was safe and well tolerated [ref].”

Great info, Kim. Thanks 

Hi, the previous link did not connect well the remaining part "a cure for cancer":

 

https://www.canceractive.com/article/is-ip6 a cure for cancer

 

I copied it from my mobile's browser:

https://www.canceractive.com/article/is-ip6%20a%20cure%20for%20cancer

 

Hopefully, it would work for this time.

 

Thanks.

Kimster


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J
 J
(@na)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 525
06/08/2020 4:40 pm  
Posted by: @gge
Posted by: @gge

I imagine that the gut phytase enzyme also damages some of the IP6 from supplements.

Apparently zinc compounds neutralizes gut phytase.
This is a study on dog food preparation. They consider phytase a problem for dogs’ absorption of food nutrients. Lots of interesting info in here.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7142709/

Would taking zinc supplements reduce the amount of IP6 needed? Zinc is usually considered a good addition to anti-cancer treatments.

May be zinc gluconate to make it even better?

It does look like it, gge. Great info.


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Kimster
(@kimster)
Joined: 8 months ago
Posts: 51
06/08/2020 6:55 pm  

Hi, just noticed the following information related to IP6:

 

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2018/06/180607140857.htm

Study identifies cellular 'death code'

Date: June 7, 2018
Source: Stanford Medicine

:

:

Seen in this light, necroptosis seems almost altruistic, but the process is also a key contributor to autoimmune diseases;

it's even been implicated in the spread of cancer.

In a new study, Carette and his collaborators discovered the final step of necroptosis, the linchpin upon which the entire process depends.

They call it "the death code."

:

:

Even if all other proteins and signaling molecules prepare MLKL for destruction, IP6 has the final say.

:

:

But only through this special genetic screen, in which they systematically tested the function of every gene at this end stage, were they able to see that IP6 was the key to necroptosis.

 

Thanks.

Kimster

 


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GgE
 GgE
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06/08/2020 7:15 pm  
Posted by: @kimster

IP6 was the key to necroptosis

Great article. The more we learn, the more important IP6 seems to be in the fight against cancer.

Thanks!


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J
 J
(@na)
Joined: 2 years ago
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06/08/2020 7:27 pm  
Posted by: @kimster

 

In a new study, Carette and his collaborators discovered the final step of necroptosis, the linchpin upon which the entire process depends.

They call it "the death code."

IP6 has the final say.

 

"the death code"...what powerful way to put it!


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GgE
 GgE
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06/08/2020 7:36 pm  

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4325021/

Monogastric animals including poultry and humans are unable to metabolize phytic acid due to the lack of sufficient level of phytate degrading enzymes activity in their digestive tract (Wodzinski and Ullah 1996; Schroder et al. 1996; Maenz and Classen 1998; Boling et al. 2000; Singh et al. 2011) and it is largely excreted in their manure.

According to this study most IP6’d in humans go to waste unless it is degraded. We’d not want either outcome. How to make it more absorbable without degradation? The solution this far seems to be ingesting a very large amount so that whatever small fraction is absorbed is enough to do the job. Anyone has a suggestion on how to improve the efficiency of the process?


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Kimster
(@kimster)
Joined: 8 months ago
Posts: 51
06/08/2020 7:36 pm  
Posted by: @gge
Posted by: @kimster

IP6 was the key to necroptosis

Great article. The more we learn, the more important IP6 seems to be in the fight against cancer.

Thanks!

Yes - we are all learning together - thanks for spending time to share information here 🙂

 

Thanks.

Kimster


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J
 J
(@na)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 525
06/08/2020 9:09 pm  
Posted by: @gge

The solution this far seems to be ingesting a very large amount so that whatever small fraction is absorbed is enough to do the job. Anyone has a suggestion on how to improve the efficiency of the process?

No, but it might be equally important not to make absorption worse, and it seems antibiotics can cause malabsorption of inositol, as can coffee (ref)


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J
 J
(@na)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 525
06/08/2020 9:22 pm  

@gge

Maybe ascorbic acid, as it´s a synergist of zinc


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Kimster
(@kimster)
Joined: 8 months ago
Posts: 51
07/08/2020 5:12 pm  

Hi, just came across the following information, so just adding here:

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7170648/

Combination of Inositol Hexaphosphate and Inositol Inhibits Liver Metastasis of Colorectal Cancer in Mice Through the Wnt/β-Catenin Pathway

16 Apr 2020

 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6678221/

Wnt Signaling in Cancer Metabolism and Immunity

28 Jun 2019

The Wingless (Wnt)/β-catenin pathway has long been associated with tumorigenesis, tumor plasticity, and tumor-initiating cells called cancer stem cells (CSCs).

 

Just trying to learn a bit more...

Thanks.

Kimster

 


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GgE
 GgE
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11/08/2020 1:54 am  

An experienced cancer researcher told me that he doubts that IP6 can get inside the cancer cells intact coming from the blood.

He also said that IP6 changes little with cellular activators such as growth factors, and that it works mostly as a phosphate storage and a neutralizer to the histones’  positive charge to keep osmotic neutrality.

Can anyone post a link to a study proving that serum IP6 actually does enter the cells?


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J
 J
(@na)
Joined: 2 years ago
Posts: 525
11/08/2020 5:01 am  

@gge

It doesn't necessarily have to enter cancer cells, phytates bind to protein, and cancer cells have a thick protein wall, and as a result could alter the functionality of the cancer cell?


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GgE
 GgE
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11/08/2020 7:10 am  

Posted by: @johan

It doesn't necessarily have to enter cancer cells, phytates bind to protein, and cancer cells have a thick protein wall, and as a result could alter the functionality of the cancer cell?

Do you know if any study where they observed this effect? It would be helpful.

Could IP6 affect so many signaling pathways and have so many GFR CT’s in the cancer cells just from the cell membranes?


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Kimster
(@kimster)
Joined: 8 months ago
Posts: 51
11/08/2020 11:55 am  

Hi friends, thank you very much for continuing the discussion.

I do not have the knowledge, so could not contribute.

I'm still learning.

 

Thanks again for contribution.

Kimster


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J
 J
(@na)
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Posts: 525
11/08/2020 7:24 pm  
Posted by: @gge

Posted by: @johan

It doesn't necessarily have to enter cancer cells, phytates bind to protein, and cancer cells have a thick protein wall, and as a result could alter the functionality of the cancer cell?

Do you know if any study where they observed this effect? It would be helpful.

Could IP6 affect so many signaling pathways and have so many GFR CT’s in the cancer cells just from the cell membranes?

@gge

No, I was just thinking out loud.

Anyway, I think the key to success is finding effective combinations, no one single substance will ever be enough to deal with such a complex disease. In the context of a multi-drug/substance approach, I think IP6 and Inositol are good candidates.


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