Would someone be willing to help with my proposed protocol?  

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Daniel
(@daniel)
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06/05/2018 7:23 pm  

Hi Shanti,

This is a very good question. I was also seeing the same logic as you do, so that I initially thought is best not to combine the two. But latter I came across research showing that actually the combo of the two leads to higher effectiveness. An example of such research is here  https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5312324/

Latter, after looking at various mechanisms that may inhibit the effectiveness of DCA, I realized there are others reasons why we may want to combine the two and that is what I discussed in my post https://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/dichloroacetate-dca-treatment-strategy/ Actually, I haven't found anywhere else that connection I made in the DCA post, while very important and could be a different way to explain the increased effectiveness when combining the two. This idea could be once tested in the lab and published 🙂

Therefore, DCA will reactivate mitochondria when that is not functional due to the PDK/PDH relation and Meformin will reduce it's activity, (but not fully inhibit). This is a form of antagonism that we may not like. On the positive side Metformin will act at other points that will enable the activity of DCA, which otherwise may not be seen at all. So overall, we end up with a combo that would be better than DCA alone. That may not apply to combining other mitochondria inhibitors in combination with DCA, and each new combo has to be specifically investigated.

Kind regards,
Daniel


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Daniel
(@daniel)
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06/05/2018 7:33 pm  

Off note, DCA + Metformin is to my knowledge a core part of Prof Dana Flavin's cancer treatment approach.


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Daniel
(@daniel)
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06/05/2018 7:51 pm  

Dear Grant,

Like Alex suggested, topical application may be a very relevant approach. I know someone with tongue tumor who was applying a 3BP solution (such as discussed on my 3BP post) on his tumor and was very happy with it's effectiveness. There are some discussions on this website on various topical solutions and you can use the search function to find the related discussions. In general, DMSO can be a good way to deliver various substances through the skin.

Kind regards,
Daniel


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Jcancom
(@jcancom)
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06/05/2018 10:19 pm  

Grant, perhaps a trip to Dayspring for 3-BP and others might be worth considering. Going to a clinic like that could be a great way to have a range of treatments done in a clinic setting. You could try out their 30 day 3-BP program and then maybe ask what they think of doing some high dose vitamin C with variants. I think that you have read the vitamin C thread and see the potential with that treatment. I would be very interested to see where they might go with intense iv vitamin C dosing. What combos? What dosing? ...  Perhaps they could set you up with a protocol and then you could take it to a nearby motel for a while if desired. Probably having one main treatment such as Vitamin C that you could then amplify up, would be more effective then having a long list of treatments that likely will be pulling in different directions. 

 Here is an article about head and neck and metabolism  

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23574725


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grant
(@grant)
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06/05/2018 11:26 pm  

Daniel

It seems to me that getting 3BP is not realistic for me.  I know a cream DCA is made, or possibly DCA + DMSO.  I did read someplace regarding DCA topically that it is tough on skin. and in my case would be tongue.  I think DCA is used for tattoo removal by debridement, so might be be risky on one's tongue.


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Shanti
(@shanti)
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08/05/2018 1:38 am  

Hi Daniel-

Thank you for your useful and interesting response.

Best,

Shanti

 

 


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Daniel
(@daniel)
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09/05/2018 12:44 am  

Hi Shanti,

My pleasure, and thank you for your valuable contribution here.

Kind regards,
Daniel


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Daniel
(@daniel)
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09/05/2018 12:51 am  

Hi Grant, 3BP is cheap and easy to access. Just take care with the use of any chemical. Understand everything you can and seek advise before doing steps forward. Kind regards, Daniel


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grant
(@grant)
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09/05/2018 8:10 am  

Daniel

I have not been able to find it to access at any price in US.  Nor have I been able to find a doctor who could knows how to "artfully" use it... but which I understand is important. Could you tell me where it is easy to access?  Same with 2 DG, I cannot find how to access it. 


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grant
(@grant)
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09/05/2018 8:59 am  

Daniel

I have a meeting in a few hours with my oncologist who gave me inductive TPF chemo in 2015, and a year ago after recurrence started me on Nivolumab in May 2017.  I am hoping to find out to what degree he might be able to assist with a new protocol.  If he is not able or willing to help, then I will look elsewhere to find an MD who might help.  I have even considered putting out $700 for a consult with Dr Dana Flavin to get some help.  I know that she has had success with metformin, DCA and low dose naltrexone.

It seems to me at this point, that applying Seyfried's ideas on a Ketogenic diet, + HBOT ( I would use EWOT instead) and then adding metformin, Mebendazole and Cimetidine, DCA with added things to protect against some negatives, as well as drugs to activate / increase SCMT 1, and if I can access MCT 1 inhibitor and MCT4 inhibitor  (which seems difficult if not impossible here) that I would at least have a substantiated broad approach as a starting point.  One major issue for me seems to be the uncertain and unclear parameters of HPV + p16 SCCHN.  What seems to be just emerging is a greater awareness of that compared to typical SCCHN.  For example, it seems that "ordinary" SCCHN is characterized by p53 and EGFR influences as a commonality.  Some research has found that those two factors are not present in HPV+ cases.  So approaches that include impacts on those are not necessarily appropriate for HPV+ cases.

Given my limited resources, it seems like I might have to just do the best I can based on postings about the above strategies and see what happens.  Meanwhile, continue looking for ways to enhance or change things as they may become available.

An issue I would really like to have some help with is the Doxy / Vit C.  First, can they be used along side what I mentioned.  Or could they be alternated in during breaks.  You mentioned the impact on immune system as a negative.

When Doxy and Vit C are used, do you know if they are used concurrently or is the Vit C done sequentially after first taking Doxy.  The research reports do not make the specifics clear to me.

finally,  what I read about the cocktail sounded like it had been used with a wide variety of other protocols, but I did not read about conflicts caused by it.  Given what you said about impact on immune system and Nivolumab, I have wondered why potential conflicts do not seem to get much attention as different protocols or options are discussed.

After I meet with my doctor later this morning, I would like to post some specific questions about various issues discussed in postings to make sure I understand what I have read and others have said.  Thank you for your willingness to share information and for your valued insights.


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Daniel
(@daniel)
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09/05/2018 10:12 pm  

Dear Grant,

In this post, I shared the chemical reference number (CAS)  https://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/2-deoxyglucose-2-dg/ and ways to access it. Shanti also mentioned a potential source. 

I hope you had a good meeting with your oncologist.

Kind regards,
Daniel


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grant
(@grant)
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13/05/2018 8:34 am  

Thanks Daniel.  I was aware of Sigma aldrich, the price is somewhat high on everything from them, however, the main obstacle for me is being able to buy it...individuals cannot, and I have not found a doctor who would access either 2 DG or 3 BP.  I am working on finding in China as I have a close friend and associate who is there often as we do business in that part of the world.  I was able to get MBZ from him.


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grant
(@grant)
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13/05/2018 8:55 am  

Regarding meeting with oncologist...went fairly well.  He did not want to prescribe LDN so am seeking appointment with a couple other doctors for that.

He did write an Rx for diclofenac K, however that has not turned out well.  The price of it is astronomically... like $1200 USD for one month.  There are some cheaper, but still several hundreds/month.  The potassium is more costly, and the diclofenac Na would only be one or two hundred.

I have a question about this and do not know the answer.  It seems from reading posts here, that Procaine (which is also hard to get in US), or diclofenac or sulindac are important in conjunction with DCA in order to reactivate and stimulate the activity of SLC5A8 / SMCT 1 in order to get DCA into the target cells.

Is the immediate release diclofenac potassium required, or would a diclofenac sodium, or extended release work as well?  How would sulindac compare to diclofenac K for increasing SCMT 1?

It seems I read that Procaine was more effective than sulindac or diclofenac at increasing SCMT 1... also I don't know whether just one would suffice, or if more than one should be used.

 

Another point of unsureness for me is DCA inducing authophagy accompanied by ROS production and mTOR inhibition.  My understanding is that increasing ROS is beneficial as to essential overpowering the cancer cell with more ROS than they can handle.  However, it seems like autophagy is a double edged sword.  Earlier cancer seems to be inhibited by autophagy, but mature or older tumors use autophagy as a survival tool.  If that is so, I wonder if the benefits of DCA are neutralized by the increase in autophagy helping mature or recurrent cancer to have more protective pathways related to autophagy.

Makes my brain hurt trying to get it all straight... not to mention the frustration of difficult access and high cost. 

Wonder what you say about the questions about diclofenac K versus Na, and sulindac and procaine as it relates to trying to maximize impact of DCA through increase of SCMT 1?

 

thanks so much Daniel


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Daniel
(@daniel)
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15/05/2018 11:59 pm  

Hi Grant, in my experience, when people really want something they will get it. There is always a way. This is not theory. It's from my own experience and that of others. I am not suggesting that you should push on getting them, that is for you to decide. Just saying that everything is possible. 🙂 Kind regards, Daniel


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Shanti
(@shanti)
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16/05/2018 1:02 am  

Hi Grant,

This is the source for LDN often cited on forums:

https://irc.bio/product/naltrexone-solution/

Of course, they have to state it is for laboratory research only. Here is the concentration: "5mg per mL, 150mg/30mL total; includes 1mL pipette." Here are the other ingredients: Solved in type II deionized water Other ingredients include ascorbate and sodium benzoate for stability purposes.

Best,

S


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