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Baicalein dosage for Breast Cancer tumor

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(@gordonh)
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 5
Topic starter  

Hi Johan,

Happy New Year!

Last year in July Daniel gifted my wife with two bottles of MCS Baicalein Pure Pro Liposomal (200mg) and two bottles of MCS Boswellia Mega AKBA Pro Liposomal.  Thank you Daniel for your generosity!

My wife had started both last July and then had to stop in just a few days because we thought a sudden increase in inflammation was due to the new pills being taken (right or wrong, was not sure).  Well since then she has been taking liquid Liposomal Fenbendazole at a daily dose of 250mg which is a bit low.  Well, sometime in September her tumor grew about 50% in size and now it is about 30-40mm in width, so we thought to cycle back to the Baicalein + Boswellia Mega AKBA in the past week.  At least her tumor has not grown since September!

My question to you is:  Each MCS Baicalein pill is 200mg.  She started it a week ago and has only been taking one pill per day.  Today I did some searching on your CTR website for dosage for my wife's situation and found the following three (3) different posts regarding Baicalein dosage.  We appear to be way under on the dosage:

1.

https://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/quercetin-a-hidden-gemstone-in-cancer-treatments/?highlight=Baicalein

“...Baicalein: depends on the source – if pure than 600mg to 1g/day...”

(posted on June 30, 2016)

2.

https://www.cancertreatmentsresearch.com/fenbendazole/?highlight=Baicalein

“…Baicalein is a very good natural extract against breast cancer – it can be bought from Chinese suppliers on Alibaba at 98% purity and mixed with oil, taken at about 400mg/day ….”

(posted on August 14, 2019)

3.

 
Posted on December 5, 2021
 
"...Oral administration of skullcap polyphenols (200 mg per kg per day) to tumor-bearing mice displayed 50% reduction in tumor volume after 7 weeks of treatment https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17516867/

So for a 60Kg human that would be approx 1000mg or 1 gram per day. Daniel will correct me if I am wrong..."

******

Question #1: The 3rd post above was yours. The first two are Daniel's. Should my wife follow the 200 mg per kg per day dosage and if so, should she slowly move up to that from the one 200 mg pill she is taking today - or transition to that greater amount immediately (aka a step function transition)?  

Question #2: If my wife should follow the 200 mg per kg per day dosage, should she take it all say in the morning or should she spread the dosage out so that say half is taken in the morning on an empty stomach and the other half before or after dinner? 

Warmest regards,

GordonH


   
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(@j)
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 2166
 

Hi @gordonh, sorry I missed your post. If you include the forum username in your post it'll send a notification via email. Mine is @j Daniel's is @daniel.

Between July and September, the tumor grew by 50%. Was she taking only Fenben during that period? And when her tumor stabilized did you do anything differently?

How much Boswellia is she taking?

Regarding Baicalein, indeed from that study I posted the equivalent human dose would be about a gram a day. Daniel mentions 600mg to 1 gram. You could start at 600mg and then up titrate to 800mg and 1000mg.

To improve bioavailability it might be a good idea to take at least some on an empty stomach. If she doesn't like that taking it with meals is fine.

Regards

Johan

 

 


   
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(@gordonh)
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 5
Topic starter  

Hi Johan,

Just now got back home from helping someone all day.

First, thank you for replying with the correct dosage.  I always appreciate your advice, suggestions, etc.  We will have her increase the dosage to 600mg then slowly move up to 1000mg.

I have two more questions at the very end of this post. Please answer those and we should be on our way with a very promising treatment!

I had first sent my question(s) directly to Daniel since he had provided the MCS products and asked him in the e-mail as to where should I post the same questions. I waited a day and decided to post it here.

Today (February 21) I received two e-mails letting me know that you had posted a reply.  The first e-mail notification came from the same e-mail address that I had sent the question(s) off to Daniel. It said that you had posted a response then a little later I received an e-mail from you stating the same information.  I had checked the box to receive automatic e-mail notification if/when anyone responds to what I had posted. 

It is all good 🙂

Now to answer your questions in a time-based sequence of events:

On August 3, 2023 my wife started taking the MCS Baicalein Pure Pro Liposomal (200mg per day) and the MCS Boswellia Mega AKBA Pro Liposomal pills (first time for both), along with the many other pills she already takes:

Several different mushroom types in four different type of pills: Turkey Tail, Maitake, Royal Sun Blazei, Black Fungis, Shiitake, Cat's Claw, Lion's Mane, Cordyceps, Reishi, and Himematsutake.

Plus PectaSol-C, Zinc, Magnesium, Selenium, Milk Thistle, Probiotic, Wheatgrass, Bergamot BPF, B-12, R-ALA, Curamed, I3C, Iodoral, Liquid CoQ10, Astralagus, Liposomal Vitamin C, Calcium, Cinsulin, CLA, Vitamin D3, Tocotrienol Vitamin E, Super DHA Fish Oil, Life Extension Super K (K1 & K2), Pine Bark Extract, and Potassium.

On August 9th my wife stopped taking the MCS Baicalein Pure Pro Liposomal and the MCS Boswellia Mega AKBA Pro Liposomal due to a sudden onset of inflammation in both legs. Not sure if that was the cause but she felt better a week later.

On September 1st, 2023 she mentioned to me that her three (3) independent tumors that were about 10mm in size and all were separated by about 5-10mm from each other had moved together into one tumor, sometime in the past month. Not sure exactly when but a month is a good approximation.

On September 6th, 2023 my wife started the Liquid Liposomal Fenbendazole (Mfr. = "Healthy Drops") at a low rate of 250mg (1 tablespoon) per day.  She did this because she had not seen any reduction with the tumor nor any growth too.  She wanted to throw something harder at it before she goes in for blood tests.  The cycle approach was roughly 5 days on, 2 days off.  It has been that way since then.

Hindsight being 20/20 she probably should have ramped up slowly to a higher dose per day of Fenbendazole.  From September through the end of January we both lost our general physician and two other doctors to retirement. In the last 12-13 years, we both have lost many doctors to retirement who were not planning to retire when they did. Many friends of ours had experienced the same fate. This all started in the 2010 to 2011 timeframe here in the USA. 

We are going to sign my wife up with a Metabolic Oncology doctor in the next month of March.  She is now fasting a bit and going even low carb and sugar (really has been doing that except for momentary quality of life / balancing exceptions having ice cream and other carbs now & then) and will get the full blood test to check all organs, the heart, cholesterol, plus several cancer markers too. This doctor will be periodically having her do another round of blood tests and her overall progression with other diagnostics too. 

On February 15th, 2024 last week, she stopped Fenbendazole and gave it a few days off of that to try Baicalein again, which she started on February 16th, 2024. Same 250mg dose as before.

On February 15th, 2024 she also started taking one Ivermectin pill (18mg) per day that also has 5,000 IU of Vitamin D3.  She keeps her overall total D3 at the 8,000 to 10,000 IU level per day.

One side note to mention to you, last night (February 20th, 2024) while I was waiting for your reply, I decided to spend a few hours and search online for any information regarding Baicalein dosage. I came across the following website that has topics related to "Frontiers in Cell and Developmental Biology" and one particular 2021 research that was performed by scientists at the Wuhan Lab in China:  https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fcell.2021.682469/full#F7

A good portion of the summary said that Baicalin (not Baicalein) using mice as test subject promoted tumor growth of the MDA-MB-231 cell line (TNBC subtype), but suppressed tumor growth of the ZR-751 cell line (Luminal breast cancer subtype). I first thought it was about Baicalein causing tumor growth.  Lesson learned.  Whew that was close ...

***One other bit of news to report that is good (we think), my wife said tonight (February 20th, 2024) to me that her nipples are both back to being the normal (for her) pink in color when they had been more of a light brown skin color (my wife is Caucasian). She thought that the last time this happened was when she last was taking Baicalein in early August last year.  She actually feels very rested today more than she has in some time. We'll see how she feels when she increases her dosage.

If she starts to feel really tired with the higher dose, I have read that it is because the cancer cells are being reduced and/or are working their way out of the body. 

Question1: Is Baicalein a product that you may have to cycle down or stop for a few days or is a person supposed to hang in there and keep taking the upper dose (i.e. 1000mg)?

Question2: Does Baicalein have any interactions with other supplements, herbs or meds that my wife should know about?

Warm regards and thank you so much !

GordonH


   
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(@gordonh)
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 5
Topic starter  

Johan,

I seem to have missed answering one of your questions concerning how much Boswellia is she taking.

The answer is that she is taking one of the Boswellia Mega AKBA Pro Liposomal and she is also taking a similar Boswellia pill per day known as "BosMed 500" which is a good brand that we already had before we received the MCS products. Once we (she) finishes the BosMed 500 she will take two Boswellia Mega AKBA Pro Liposomal pills per day.  If this (plus Baicalein) works well for her we will definitely be return MCS customers!

Best regards,

GordonH


   
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(@j)
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 2166
 

Posted by: @gordonh

Johan,

I seem to have missed answering one of your questions concerning how much Boswellia is she taking.

The answer is that she is taking one of the Boswellia Mega AKBA Pro Liposomal and she is also taking a similar Boswellia pill per day known as "BosMed 500" which is a good brand that we already had before we received the MCS products. Once we (she) finishes the BosMed 500 she will take two Boswellia Mega AKBA Pro Liposomal pills per day.  If this (plus Baicalein) works well for her we will definitely be return MCS customers!

Best regards,

GordonH

Hi Gordon,

Here's more information on the use of Boswellia:

https://www.naturalmedicinejournal.com/journal/boswellia-and-brain-tumors

If you don't see any benefit in taking 2 caps, about a gram of Boswellia maybe the dose isn't enough. Both brands are fine.

Regards

Johan

 

 


   
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(@gordonh)
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 5
Topic starter  

Hi Johan,

Thank you for the link regarding the use of Boswellia.  It is much appreciated.

You asked about the timeline concerning when the tumor grew and when my wife started taking Fenbendazole. Please read my post above dated

At the very end of that post (above), I had asked two really important questions concerning Baicalein.  We really need to know the answer to these two questions before my wife can proceed using Baicalein.

For your convenience, here are those two questions again:

Question1: Is Baicalein a product that you may have to cycle down or stop for a few days or is a person supposed to hang in there and keep taking the upper dose (i.e. 1000mg)?

Question2: Does Baicalein have any interactions with other supplements, herbs or meds that my wife should know about?

Warm regards,

GordonH


   
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(@j)
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 2166
 

Posted by: @gordonh

Hi Johan,

Thank you for the link regarding the use of Boswellia.  It is much appreciated.

You asked about the timeline concerning when the tumor grew and when my wife started taking Fenbendazole. Please read my post above dated

 

Hi Gorden,

Could you provide the link to that post dated , I'm unable to see it, nor does your forum activity show the post (see attachment). 

 


   
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(@j)
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 2166
 

Posted by: @j

Posted by: @gordonh

Hi Johan,

Thank you for the link regarding the use of Boswellia.  It is much appreciated.

You asked about the timeline concerning when the tumor grew and when my wife started taking Fenbendazole. Please read my post above dated

 

Hi Gorden,

Could you provide the link to that post dated , I'm unable to see it, nor does your forum activity show the post (see attachment). 

 

 

Question1: Is Baicalein a product that you may have to cycle down or stop for a few days or is a person supposed to hang in there and keep taking the upper dose (i.e. 1000mg)?

You don't want to be taking any supplement or drug that isn't producing results. Shrinkage of tumors or stable disease at the very least is what you're looking for. 

Question2: Does Baicalein have any interactions with other supplements, herbs, or meds that my wife should know about?

Any drug your wife takes please check if there's an interaction. A simple search e.g. "drug X" + "baicalein" drug interaction, should give you that information.

 


   
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(@gordonh)
Joined: 1 year ago
Posts: 5
Topic starter  

Hello Johan,

For my wife the minimum dose of Fenbendazole Liquid (Healthy Drops) (250mg) is not working as of late and her tumor has grown about 1cm.  We do have Mebendazole and Baicalein and will be trying out each individually (Baicalein first, as my wife said it was working for the few months she was taking it, then she had some bad inflammation and quit it thinking it was the cause. We really weren't sure of that) then if needed together.  I checked for compatibility of these two and it looked fine (no interactions).  I just wanted to ask if you know of anyone taking these two together?

Best regards,

GordonH


   
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(@j)
Joined: 6 years ago
Posts: 2166
 

@gordonh 

Hi Gordon, just saw your message. I'm sure people have used that combination, it should be fine.

Regards

Johan

 


   
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(@daniel)
Admin
Joined: 9 years ago
Posts: 1194
 

@gordonh Hi Gordon, as you are a contributor on this Blog and since your wife feels Baicalein may help her, if you need help with that please email me, and we will donate a few more of those. Of course, this is not meant as a replacement of conventional options, if any available.

Kind regards,
Daniel


   
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